Oh, yeah, and by the way, we actually are copying this drawing just by publishing it on our own gallery!!! SO HA! Scammedju!

I agree, but this is something thats really hard to change! I don't think its right for u to delete someone elses work only if they want to make changes or do what they think would look good! Remember that although many ppl draw others work unmercifully, there are many who mean with good intentions! I beleive that if ur work gets "ripped" you should first give 3 polite warnings, or plz ask them to give it back or at least let u sign it before they copy it, and if they refuse, call matt and andrew.
(on different matters we must get matt and andrew more involved on the sight to oversee and fix and help the site!)
Plus, sometimes my friends will draw stuff, ask my opinion, and ask me too add on!!! what should i do about that?!?!?
Plus i dont think u should have fullout access to delete others drawings simply because u dont want them to be copied, i mean u may have put a lot into ur drawing but they may have too!!!!
Theres more to this matter but i will sign because i know these opinions and views, if viewed,would not be fullout accepted and there would probably be changes made, so yes i will sign even though i dont agree with all of this pettion.

Art theft is bad, but, if they are changing it, who cares? Maybe if they would leave a note saying, I didnt draw the part that they rlly did not draw, maybe u guys would b ok. If they chang something, for better or for worse, who the heck cares. If they draw stick figures on ur drawing, they want to make people laugh. If they just simply add a dot, then I can agree, but what if they just did that because they didnt want to go back and take a rly long time to find that same person, and they couldnt change that person's drawing right then, so they just added a dot? You cannot call that stealing. But, whatever, I'll sign the petition anyway. Also, just comment the person and ask why they took your drawing [unless its an Add drawing-add a dot, add your fu name, etc.] they'll probly right back and tell u why.

To Matt & Andrew: I would like to add my name to this petition, because I recently had two of my "drawings" "ripped off", and they are sitting in someone else's gallery. Maybe you could give these people who steal other people's artwork a "warning"....and if they don't "heed" the warning....maybe you could "ban" them from coming to sketchfu. I think other people who draw here at sketchfu, who also have had their artwork "ripped off" would really appreciate any help and solutions that you might come up with. Thank you for listening to my "complaint".

Because I know everyone here wants to read/hear this!

Matt and Andrew ROCK THIS HOUSE!

I have never had quicker response time from anyone, anywhere!

One troll down! Defaced works removed and member banned almost instantly! WOW!

Thanks for relieving me of my angst gentlemen & lifting my spirits enough to get back to putting some color in my world.

;) <- Miss A.

Well, I am fairly new to Sketchfu and already, just yesterday, I had someone nab something I tagged as unfinished and put silly stick figures on it,.....grrrr. I know I'm no Rembrandt or anything, but, it still chapped my behind. I had not tagged the image for sharing or sent it out to anyone.

Okay, so IF, perhaps, it had been done after I had posted it as finished, I might not have been as miffed, but that's not the point.

What Matt and Andrew have done with this site is just awesome! And I do believe that whatever changes are to be made need to be done in a way that bring as little grief as possible to the Sketchfu "gods".....er..... creators. Did I kiss up enough?....lol. Serioulsy, I am learning and enjoying my time here and would like to keep it that way.

So,...... I'm thinking a lock button feature, available to the original artist only, would be the best way to stop add-ons. It would bypass having to even think about asking someone to delete a derivative work. (Which I did nicely and still had someone else butt in and make "not-so-nice" comments about it.....geez! I said PLEASE and THANK YOU!) Something the O. A. could lock or unlock at will to allow for their own additions at a later time would be awesome if possible.

Deleting the download button wouldn't keep the real thiefs from getting the final product and posting it to another site. It's just too easy to do right from your keyboard and clipboard to any paint program. Nothing, if anything you can do then.

I know that part of the fun of this site is getting to know each other, apprecciating others styles, and maybe getting some tips and constructive critisim. That is precisely why I'm looking forward to my future days here at Sketchfu.

Thanks for lending an ear or two.

Coffee's gone now and I haven't drawn a thing yet!....lol.

Enjoy the day all & keep the colors flowing!!

Miss A.

i agree with all.. yep

i agree with "no stealing art" and one idea is...besides Fizzy's is to have an ADD-ON sketch room? or have an 'open' drawing choice and 'closed' drawing choice, (button). I don't know how hard these ideas would be to apply, because Ihave no computer sense in these matters, but if I can help in any way, let me know!

Thanks Andrew. Fizzy was kind of working on distilling this down more like you asked so if he can do that, it might help, lotsa long comments here. I am curious tho, did you two anticipate this kind of growth? And did you expect to see the caliber of art that is showing up here? Maybe the simplest thing to do would be split the site into two areas, one for playing around and remixing and one for "serious Art" not meant to be remixed. i know, that gets into the what is art, but i think the "want to play arounders" will just stay in their area if the artist area cannot be copied or downloaded or remixed. It would need to be able to be saved a WIP and also remixed by the artist themselves for changes tho. If a kid comes and draws something that is obviously not graffitti, defacing then they are welcome to be an "artist". The person would choose where they want to be. That would put communal draws in the Play section. I don't know how hard that coding would be but it would let everyone do what they want. Of course the two choices would have to be listed on the homepage with descriptions of each. Sorry, I have too many ideas!! *L*

thank you for all the feedback - Matt and I will look through all of this and try to figure out something simple that we can do. We definitely appreciate your opinions, since you guys now know more about the site than we do!

Let's keep discussing this, and if you guys have more ideas, please post and tell us.

Thanks for your feedback. I did report to Andrew and today sent it all to Matt. You're right. If this kind of spirit co-ops the enormous goodwill and warm, open sharing that's developed on this site, it becomes a very different place. I feel for Matt and Andrew, though. I'm sure the LAST thing they want to become is a hall monitor for adolescents. I wish they could quickly install a remedy to prevent this kind of thing.

Thank you, Gerry, for your advice and support.

The lil 14 yr old who stole mine has not returned so there mine sits, piling up views on HER gallery!

Hello, Gerbear. Well now I've experienced not only my art being ripped off but a rude remark back from the "thief" saying they took it because "they could". How do you like them apples?? The little buggers screen name is Bloodthrister. Read his comment on my profile...

What do you suggest I do?

A simple "lock " button to prevent add ons and a "unlock" button to "unlock" pics for those who wish to do "chain pics" or "color me/finish me" pics or for those who just don't care. It would be simple enough, I would think, flickr has spaceball, the code could be written in for the "block" or "lock" button. Seems like it could work.

Back from out of town. Lady C, you have put things very well and i understand your reasoning about the voting. i agree in that i don't want to see more work for Matt/Andrew at all, but i don't like the voting. You will get kids that are mad at other kids and get all their friends to vote against the draw even if it is not inappropriate. I think the button that gives the original artist complete control over remixes and copies on their draws is the way to go. for communal drawings, each new artist just has to release the drawing again. Once an artist releases a drawing for the public to play with, they need to be aware how it might be used. If it weren't for the young kid factor I think the voting would be fine, tho I don't look at recent draws ever, I don't have time.

I like alot of your ideas, but centaurs the best with the voting system idea. It's a perfect idea. (sorry I havent been on this weekend much!!)

I think I was one of the first to start a movement regarding this, so I do feel quite strongly about it. I’ve got a petition on my profile if anyone wants to check out the first discussion that was up here. But seeing everyone get fired up again made me think about this problem differently and I’ve thus come up with some thoughts on solving this issue.

1) First and foremost, Fizzy's idea was probably the most practical thing I've seen in this discussion to date: "Maybe an idea is to add an add-on checkbox: when ticked the drawing cannot altered by anyone other the original author. That way people don't have to actively police, nor do they have to be afraid that their WIPs will be stolen, while still allowing things like community drawings and the like.."

2) Second of all, I also agree with the restricting "undo strokes" for "based-on" drawings. But that won't help if people touch up the drawing and paint over the signature.

3) Which finally brings me to a new idea, which is a spin on the "flagging" system. To save Matt and Andrew a lot of work (a LOT of work, mind you, with copied or defaced drawings), the flagging system should work in the following manner: if say, five, seven, ten users (this can be decided at a later time) flag a drawing as "stolen" or "inappropriate" (there should be at least two different flags), then that drawing gets deleted AUTOMATICALLY. And there are quite a few users here that are online frequently and unintentionally end up monitoring this sort of thing, if simply by surfing the site. Now if the artist whose drawing got deleted is upset with this, they can "appeal" to Matt and Andrew, who can judge the situation themselves. The drawing isn't GONE from the site, they just can't put it back up without Matt and/or Andrew's help. The purpose of this is to monitor stolen artwork in such a way that Matt and Andrew can stay out of the picture 75-90% of the time, as they are constantly swamped with messages and other administrative tasks. That way, they will only get involved if the person who has copied or stolen a drawing which then got "banned" will bring it to Matt and/or Andrew's attention, which (and correct me if I'm wrong) should not be happening too often. Mind you, these “flagging options” will, or should, appear only on “based-on” drawings, so no pranksters can get rid of original art by way of this system. And if a flagged drawing was cheered, when it gets deleted automatically, the cheers for the flagged and deleted drawing should be deducted. That way, we take away both incentive and consequence, and get rid of problems such as those that Sunsi was facing with the “page-views-and-cheers-hope-you-understand” nonsense.

That way, normal additions like “CWFUBR-RWFUBC” drawings will still be around, as will community drawings. But as soon as a substantial amount of people will flag a drawing, it will be gone and newcomers and other users won’t mistake copied drawings for originals. Problem solved.

Or so I hope.

If anyone has any suggestions, please feel free to state them. But I do feel strongly about these three points. I am more than confident that most of our problems would go away with such a system.

Lady C

Neku I really like that idea. But ineke and darkforest Warrior have good points too about it. Matt and Andrew would know what could be done code wise. I would vote for you being redirected to the ORIGINAL first, that sure would make me feel better and like i have more control because if it is just a rip off with no changes, no one will surf to the rip off and those people will not get the attention paid to their gallery that they want. Actually...about community draws, there is a problem with them and this solution would solve both!!! Many of the community draws go off in many directions and no one sees them all or many don't get finished. If you were redirected to the original you could look at the thumbs and follow the trail and add your addition to the correct picture.
that would be great. What i mean is, sometimes i do a community draw and 3 people come and add to it, but they are each adding to a different copy! That solution would actually help in two ways, and if it ould be turned off by the artist, say as a profile option like getting the emails, then we could turn it off for redo's or community stuff that does not need to be synced.

maybe any cheers given to a remix could automatically also be given to the original? That might be weird though...

The whole getting taken to the original first might be confusing, too.
Hmm...

Taking you to the original fist might work... except with community drawings, especially those that tend to branch off in various directions.
I guess adding a 'return to the remix'-button might solve that though.

People shouldn't make something UGLY or SEX ABBSESSED from a picture that isn't supposed to be that.

Perhaps if a drawing is remixed, when you click on it it will take you to the original FIRST, and then below the original there can be a thumbnail of the remixed picture. That way the original artist gets credit for their work BEFORE the remixer does, and still the person changing the art can be seen and what not.

I know this won't STOP the silly stupidity that's going on with people not MAKING any changes to a picture and then posting it, but if it automatically takes you to the ORIGINAL image, then it'll definitely be more of a comfort since the original gets the credit either way and can be cheered before a plagiarized remix is on accident.

agreed w/ original poster.

I dont think that the unable remixers to undo strokes because that will keep the origanal artist frome changing what they dont like at the time. For example, mabye I draw something and like what i did to it,but then afterwords I dont like it and cant change it. That will become a huge problem because that happens often with me and it probobly happens with other people as well. Thats what I think.

Chris, i agree that artists should not have the ability to delete others work altho at first i wanted to. But they should have some sort of recourse. I think if they are asked twice to take it down themselves and don't, then it is 3 strikes and you are out. with the draws with only one dot like happened to me, that girl has not returned and there my picture sits. now most ppl will not take the time to click on the original after they have already seen a copy. So the artist loses ALL those potential viewers who by rights, should have seen the draw in the context of the artists gallery and maybe seen other work they liked. I am not a publicity hound, but i like the feedback, it helps me know what i am doing that is popular or unpopular. I am exploring artistic avenues now, and the online feedback really is help to me. So I think the Mods/admins should take the drawings down if the artist has tried to get the thief to do it and got no results. but none of this works unless they are warned on the home page about copyrite infringement.

I worry that if we can delete someone elses artwork they might be able to delet our originals.... my first experience of theft was aportrait of my mother- someone had added a cigarettein her mouth.. since my father died of a heart attack at age 50 from smoking you can imagine I was not pleased. I also hate finding my drawings untouched or with an extra dot!!! and copied, however I have taken to writing things like " so what have you added to my drawing?" or something along those lines to the person who has appropriated it.
I do agree that remixes are an important part ou sketchfu... the composite pictures people draw are fantastic. and you can generally recognise a plagarist because they have a lot of bad or weak pictures with a good one in the mix.... I think the moderators should have the final say though- otherwise you could just have a free for all. I have known contributors to other sites ask for all thier drawings to be deleted- that must be a thankless and depressing task!

Here is an idea for Home page content or some other page or even on all the pages in the galleries. This is from flikers site.

Copyright Infringement
If you see your photographs in another member’s photostream, don't panic. This is probably just a misunderstanding and not malicious. A good first step is to contact them and politely ask them to remove it. If that doesn't work, please file a Notice of Infringement with the Yahoo! Copyright Team who will take it from there.

You may be tempted to post an entry in our public forum about what's happening, but that's not the best way to resolve a possible copyright problem. We don't encourage singling out individuals or their photos in our public forum.

Hi everyone, thanks for writing us on this topic. We've been working hard on this from the start of the site, because the remixing is both the heart of the site as well as the source for some of this friction.

Here are some of the things we've worked on over the last couple months to make it easier for people to spot the originals, avoid defacement, and own their work:

1) Originally, we didn't even have attributions - we added "Based on this drawing" and showed the chain of ownership

2) We didn't have the ability to delete drawings at the beginning, and we specifically developed that ability to remove drawings that were offensive.

3) We also made a new feature to be able to ban bad users that were repeat offenders, and have done so with a bunch of people.

4) We added a "download picture" link for people to store the originals of their drawings, for future use

5) We added some drawing management functions like deletion of your own stuff, in order to make it so that things like WIP or other drawings don't end up getting remixed accidentally.

I think the real heart of this issue is that when a drawing is getting remixed, how does the system automatically figure out whether it's a GOOD addition, or a BAD addition? And what controls do we give to people that respect both the art of the adders, as well as the original artists?

At the extreme, it's clear (at least to me) that taking out remixing is a bad idea. And at the other extreme, having remixes without attributions is also a bad idea. What's the right mix?

I've heard a couple suggestions:

1) Add a members-only section with dues and criteria for "regulars"
2) Remove the ability for remixers to undo any strokes, so that you don't have people undo-ing signatures
3) Adding a report abuse button
4) Letting any original artist delete or hide the work of a remixer

... what else? If you guys can create a nice bulleted list that continues on the one I have above, it would really help Matt and I during this discussion.

Again, please realize that remixing is at the heart of Sketchfu, and one person's "hijack" is another person's artistic reinterpretation. We need to be respectful of everyone's contributions to the site.

I think perhaps a round table discussion with Matt and Andrew might be in order. perhaps we could make a drawing in FUWorlds gallery so everyone can partake.

I think the foremost questions to of ask of Matt and Andrew is this: Did you have any idea that Sketchfu would grow like this and what are your future plans. This is only a "hobby" for them I think because they have other jobs, but if it continues to grow it could generate some income. We need to know how much time they can/will give to, which might help determine how much time we want to give to it.

There are many artists here who would like some protection for their work. I don't think that Matt/Andrew quite realized how badly a site like this was needed for more experienced artists as well as ppl just wanting to play around. Perhaps a members only section could be added, with dues or some kind of criteria for "regulars". Or maybe a report abuse button and moderators who could handle that instead of Matt and Andrew having to.

Being part of a community of artists is important to me. I only know a couple here locally. I think Sketchfu is wonderful and the people here are amazing as is the art. I hope all of the issues can get resolved so that everyone stays. I am aware that once you put anything on the web, art, words, photos, it is in the public arena and subject to abuse. But within the confines of the site itself I feel clear cut rules should be listed and followed. Right now if we ALL police the site, ie, if someone takes your art without permission then go and ask them to delete it, then word should get around it is frowned upon. But every artist would need to police their own work or it would not be fair for some to be allowed to steal and some not to.

Anyhow, have we reached any kind of a consensus here to approach Matt and Andrew with? If we could distill this all down I'd repost it in a thread in FUWorld.

I think mostly everyone here remembers when I "left" Sketchfu out of sheer frustration. I believe the crux of this discussion parallels what I experienced and the frustration that everyone feels with people ripping off your art and doing whatever it is they do with it.

I voiced my frustration and protested by basically boycotting any further activity on this site primarily because of the fact that drawings on which I may have spent hours failed to publish and were lost forever. In a sense, that was worse than having someone deface a drawing that you were able to at least publish before being subjected to manipulation by people with small minds.

However, I realize that the issue still remains where we are being made to feel anxious, worried, frustrated and angry about what happens to our precious drawings once they are published. There is really no easy solution and I believe that the administrators would make instantaneous changes to the program if they actually could to prevent original drawings from being hijacked.

I believe that it would take some time and a lot of work for the administrators to implement some of the changes that we (those of us involved in this discussion)are suggesting. Ethically speaking, I agree that taking someone's original work and calling it your own is dead wrong...words and phrases such as 'plagarism', 'art theft', 'theft of intellectual property', 'copyright infringement', etc. come to mind and in the "REAL" world are punishable by fines and jail sentences!

However, as previously mentioned by gerbear, the way this site is set up currently, leaves the door wide open for just that. There probably is no legal recourse available if we were to find our own artwork on some commercial advertising, etc. which was used to generate money for the party who stole it. But, I realize now, I am stating the obvious. As far as offering my own suggestions to help combat the 'art theft' problem, I feel that any changes will take time. To wit, I know that we have repeatedly asked for a DELETE COMPLETELY feature that would allow us to get rid of WIP's and other unwanted scraps of art and even comments on our profile page have gone unfulfilled.

I think that a "Report this Drawing" button should be included under each drawing so that the administrators can be alerted to abuse or objectionable drawings immediately and promptly. But again, what would prevent a vindictive person from going through anyone's gallery and clicking that button as revenge or to 'cry wolf' (akin to pulling the fire alarm when there is no fire)? Fizzy's idea about creating a "Lock" feature sounds like a great idea. Essentially, the 'temporarily delete' feature works the same way. If the originator of a drawing had the ability to 'lock' and 'unlock' these pictures it could work in two ways: 1) To prevent tampering and eliminate "This drawing is based on..." copies of the original and 2) To disable the "Download" feature. Granted, this will not prevent those ambitious enough to do what gerbear had mentioned: Do a "Print Screen" and manipulate that image on Photoshop or other application. But I believe that type of 'hijacking' would be extremely rare.

Definitely, under the terms and conditions, it should be clearly written that plagarism will not be tolerated along with objectionable pieces of art and that two warnings will be issued before the account is shut down and that individual will be banned from SF. Also like gerbear suggested, a short, easy-to-understand statement should be posted on the page of every drawing advising them of the consequences of violating the terms and conditions.

I hope this helps; if nothing else, at least you know where I stand with regard to this 'art theft' issue. May the FU's be with all of us!!

It would seem that a notice on the home page with a gentle statement that artists prefer not to have their work put in anothers gallery without permission, or have it senselessly defaced and then some sort of permission button for the artist. It would be simple, could be worded politely and would TEACH those 12 yrs olds what the world is about. If some kid asked me if they could put my drawing on their site and mess with it, I actually would say yes. It is the "stealing and passing it off as your own to get people into your gallery" aspect that I hate. Should I really care if that happens, no, probably not, but I put hours of MY time into my draws so, right or not, mature or not, I do care.

*nod* I agree, there should be some way to stop art theft. I have seen it far too many times here. :(

Not sure exactly what could be done about it though.
(sorry, late in discussion)

sorry i meant to say keep "based on" even after the WIP or original is deleted.

I just think they should keep the "based on" even when the original WIP was created. That would take care of the pic looking like the "thief" made it. I agree with smws. I've had stuff stolen, my sig erased and so on too, but the 'forgery' only got a couple of cheers and the guy even deleted it after I asked. I dig that we can all draw all over everyones stuff. Oh well. 12 year olds do NOT know that they are offending us XD :)

Ah, hmmm, well, I came kind of late to this discussion, but for whatever reason I wanted to add my $.02... In fact (please don't be cross) I basically disagree with most of you. Unless you've erased the original, there's always the "this drawing is based on..." thing at the bottom. It seems like most people understand intuitively how that works- unchanged or vandalized copies rarely get more than a few cheers, anyway, and I hate to restrict the fertility and freedom of the site. I know that it's not *nice* to be a troll and scrawl over somebody's work, but the beauty of Sketchfu is that the original remains.

Of course, I haven't had a personal experience with this, so that may color my judgement. I guess my main feeling is that the flexibility of the internet and the precise attribution (literally, every stroke can be assigned to someone...) makes "theft" pretty silly... you can just see the original with one click, right?

I'm not trying to make anyone angry, just saying what I think. Feel free to respond here or in my profile. I also suppose I could live with the checkbox solution, but maybe by default it could be "allow"?

-smws

just read this from Fizzy, sounds perfect if it can be done, would solve the no community draw issue too.

"Maybe an idea is to add an add-on checkbox: when ticked the drawing cannot altered by anyone other the original author. That way people don't have to actively police, nor do they have to be afraid that their WIPs will be stolen, while still allowing things like community drawings and the like.."

Good points. it is all a tuff call, if we stop letting people draw at all on our work, by writing that out of the program, then we lose the community draws and I have enjoyed them so much I dont want to do serious work!1 *L* We need more ideas and feedback I think.

I was just wondering... How much should be added to a drawing for it to be acceptable as addition? Sometimes a few dots can add something new to a picture; think it will be difficult to make guidelines for it. The same goes for funny add-on versus defacing (take f.i. the CWFUBR series as an example of positive screwing things up :)
It mainly boils down to the intention of the person doing it, and consent (if possible, not everyone's here 24/7).

Maybe we can distill all of this down to a few main ideas that we can present to Matt and Andrew. Please keep looking back and giving input. I am sure there is a fairly easy, elegant solution to this that won't cause Matt and Andrew too much work. The solution might not be perfect, but there has to be some kind of effort made in some way. It is clear everyone is in agreement on that. One problem with my solution is that if the person never shows up again, the draw stays forever in their gallery and will show up on featured drawings, etc etc and invariably there will be people clicking on it again. If I spend 1-3 hours on a draw which i do frequently, I have earned the right for them to come and see it in MY gallery, where I receive the feedback on MY art which I find very helpful. not on an ego level, I am a teacher and it helps me to see what people like, in my gallery and others.

Give cheers every time some one copys you or someone cheers the copy???

*repost, as requested by Geri*
I think the whole art theft thingy is pretty silly.. I really don't see what use it is for someone to just take someone else's pic and claim it as your own. Especially when everyone can see you didn't draw it from the 'based on' part above and below the drawing.
Still, people do seem to do it.. I've had at least one of my drawings ripped, with the only addition a very crude 'I drew this' which mainly boggled me rather than angered me. I know what I made and to have others copying it is .. well, flattering, in a sense. I would hate if people would just draw cumshots on my pics though, seen at least 1 person doing that :S

Still, allowing someone to delete drawings from others sounds like it could cause loads of problems too.. What if someone bases another drawing on the drawing you deleted? Will that be deleted too? If you do this at least make it so the person itself still has the drawing in their account (just as it is when you delete a drawing now) so it wont be lost entirely.

Maybe an idea is to add an add-on checkbox: when ticked the drawing cannot altered by anyone other the original author. That way people don't have to actively police, nor do they have to be afraid that their WIPs will be stolen, while still allowing things like community drawings and the like..

I see the same young woman in question also also "borrowed" one of my drawings too - I wouldn't mind if she had added somehing interesting but to just scribble over it seems so pointless. I'm a bit cross, to put it politely - but if I had the kind of talent so many of you guys do I would be absolutely furious to see pictures I had put hours of work into stolen or defaced.

I like Menopaws's idea...but isn't it better to prevent people to steal one another's art? I saw it a few times when someone copied one of my drawings, without adding or removing anything and then just give it another title so it looked like he or she made it. The only way to see that such 'fake' drawing is yours, is by the tiny picture below with the sentence: This drawing is based on/Drawings based on this.
That is the ONLY way to see someone else actually made the original drawing. So, isn't it an idea, based on that and Menopaws's idea, to warn or even ban people from this site? I don't have a specific idea, but maybe it can be worked out by someone.

So I guess we should go to Matt and Andrew's profile page and tell them there. If we all did it they would be flooded with the same message. Other wise these seem to go unnoticed. --**this was brought over from a nother petition as requested by Gerbear. ...but continuing along the same line, even though, they are, I'm sure, swamped with other issues here, maybe we should pick someone to ask Matt and Andrew to come to this petition and read it and respond. I wonder why we each can't have a gallery like other sites, where the art can't be tampered with unless invited to do so. I like that idea of writing my name in my drawings, bakakaoki. I'm doing it from now on.

**Ger...just read your last post and that sounds more than reasonable. Has anyone actually talked to Matt and Andrew and have them respond? Like I said, they have to buried under thousands of messages a day with all those friends! =o hehee. Hopefully we can get their attention and you or someone who this has happened to can speak for all of us.

*sigh* ... Don't really see any simple resolution to this problem; being a "tech 'tard" I have no solutions to offer, either. And even if 12 year olds are doing this, by the age of 12 you ought to know right from wrong, and stealing someone else's efforts is still theft ... there's no excuse, no matter what your age. Could we report the offenders to the FUmeisters and have a "three strikes you're out" rule ... three complaints and you're banned?

I really like tgat idea. The only thing i dont like are drawing destroyers. i made a nice drawing then someone based something on it and wrecked it completely. but, they finally deleted it.

i have an idea! wat about writing ur name/sig at the beginning before drawing and take ur time with it then start the drawing and a few times writing in ur name and then erasing it! until u get to the end and finally signing it! therefore they cant say its by them! or making a note at the beginning saying, 'this is by ....' ur username! then that way ppl will know if someone stole it! just a though tho...

First of all, I will try to get these comments to the others who have signed the petition, ie, another copy has ended up on their site. I will suggest that the actual discussion be held here so we can all see what everyone thinks. It might get long, but it certainly will be interesting and helpful with so much input. That said, here is my idea. I think that keeping it simple would be the best idea. It IS the net after all and if someone wants to "swipe" a pic one way or another they can. They could even use "print screen" command from keyboard, save it to a paint program and manipulate it from there. There is always a way. What I feel now, after having settled down and read all the comments is...I feel Sketchfu just needs a home page with some basic rules for the site. On this issue it could be simply stated that one is to ASK the original artist before using their work in any way and that if the original artist requests their work be taken down because the changes are objectionable (too violent, pornographic content, bad language written on drawing, scribbled over, whatever WE or Matt and Andrew decide) then the artist who took it must comply. Give them X number of chances then delete their account. If this is CLEARLY stated on a homepage, it will cut down on the people who innocently take pictures not realizing the problem it can cause. I think this is the majority of the picture takers. So just a simple rule, clearly stated on a home page. I don't believe in censorship but do believe in professional artistic courtesy with the actual artist having the final say based on clear cut rules. The only deleting would be done by the picture taker. Any thoughts?

I really think it should just send a message to the original artist asking for permission. That way if you accept then that person can use your picture... The only problem I can think of with this method though is that once you actually manage to give permission then the inspiration to do the changes might be long gone for the person asking. >_<

Idea: You can always sign your art in the middle of your drawing before you publish and draw some more and finish it so that the undo's don't take out your sig.

The problem with being able to delete others' artwork based on yours is that it inhibits the ability to take another piece and make significant mods to it... what if the other person doesn't like it and deletes it? Is that preferable? Besides, the only available "delete" command comes with "undelete." Is it even possible to make it so that once you delete someone else's artwork they can't undelete it? Suddenly, *you* own all work based on your work... I don't know, it feels wrong.

What about (1) disabling "undo" command on published drawings, so that people can't delete your signature? (2) making the "deleted" drawing still show up in "based on"? (3) engaging some sort of reporting or administrator adjudication feature for disputed artworks... so that the admin (hahaha, more work for M&A!!!) can take a look at disputed pieces and determine whether to delete?

Anyone have other ideas?

This really makes me feel uncomfortable.

This was such a nice utopia! Could have been such a: "imagine all the people.." Just before I had noticed this crappy bit.
:(

Now, each time I sit down to draw I have this feeling in the back of my head "somebody downloading what Im doing and doing something unfair to it.."


I, for one, wouldnt be more comfortable in a censored sketchfu, though... like if there were restrictions on what one can or cannot draw.. That sort of thinking sucks.

I guess I really just was too naive to think that anybody could be so twisted as to claim somebodys work, sweat and tears to be their own. Oh, but of course there are such people! Any idea what they might be gaining, besides some fake social recognition in another forum?

yes i agree with u....am an amateur....not yet excelled with my sketching skills since its just a hobby that i follow....but people can use our creativity...a precious thing one owns...i hope this helps...

the sad thing is, that the internet will always have this problem in some form or another, there is always a way to copy unless it is written into a program to prevent this, and seeing as the drawings didn't originate from our end we have no way of doing anything about this. I have had some girls ask to "use" my art on their page because they like the subject matter and I o.k.'d it and they made note of it that it was not their own. I just really think there should be an approval notice from our end before someone can "use" a picture to "alter", and only then can the picture be added on to or published. Unfortunately, it will probably take a lot of programming changes to do this and I am not sure we will see any resolution to this problem because of that. The site's origional intent was for others to add on and make changes, but just as we all know there are those who have small minds and can't do anything for themselves and will ruin and deface and steal others' pictures, something I am sure Matt and Andrew weren't really thinking about at the time of their "good" intentions...when writing this program. It was an innovative idea, that they had no way of forseeing the bad side of at the time. As always it takes one bad apple...the other thing that should be done, as on another site is make those who join sign a user agreement with each picture they draw, it doen't allow copyrighted materials, obscene, exessively bloody or graphic or sexually explicit pictures to be drawn, if they violate the agreement they are given a warning, and if they continue, they are blocked from the site. But there they have flaws too...a rating system that doesn't allow for all to see pictures that are done throughout the day or week as we have, it will only list 5 pages at a time of new drawings and it has a rating system of 1-10 which anyone can take a really good drawing that should be rated a 9 or a 10 and vote a 1 or a 2 because they are jealous or just plain malicious. And how does one truely rate a 1-10 rating when everyone has different tastes? so at least here there is a better rating system. So is there a resolution? I am not sure. I suppose they could take out the redraw /add on feature. but if someone still wants it on another site all they have to do is download and I really want to keep that feature so I can keep my works on a cd. Again the download could be made to work for the just the artist and their pics, but then those who can't get a play on a pic use the download to see the final result and they won't be able to view some works, so who knows...???? Maybe the thumbnails can have a double click enlarge feature again who knows????

Rynnakat, as I said in my message to you on your profile, this was not an innocent mistake. She has already stolen another persons artwork AND got a very angry response from them, they shot her the bird in an ascii picture and wrote a nasty note to her. She knows. That is why I am so mad, because she knows.n Alfinch I didnt know that could even happen. I keep forgetting to sign my original drawings tho i guess that makes no difference.

I agree with you guys, but the one that took gerbears pic is only on here for 14 days and I am SURE they don't know that what they did was "rude". I bet when they log on they will delete the picture.

What really winds me up is when I draw something and delete it (like a WIP for example) only to find it has been copied. That way it looks as if the person who copied it is the original author... painful to see :(

It isn't just only the 14 year olds who adopt art and call it their own. In the past I had a situation with a long timer on this site who took many of my pieces, made minor changes and they showed up in his gallery. In fact I found one of MY pieces on another of his sites and he called it his. I'd done the piece in black and white and he added color.
However, after I asked him to stop, he did.

However, it left an uncomfortable feeling to see personal work co-oped by someone else.

Amen to that! Plagiarism should not be allowed ... even if it's just by a clueless teenybopper. And then there are the trolls who deface pictures .... grrrr!

Sunsi that is completely correct and that is what angers me so!!

I've had this a lot.. I think it's a little frustrating when nothing is changed but the title when republishing someone else's work.. I don't mind if there's some change made, like cocolinoneverdie's one on my troll or the dancer on my 'mountains' (don't remember who's that was now..Rynnakat's?). But they were clever changes. I liked them.
But what comes to 'rippers', I've asked them to delete those works several times, but no one has really took notice so far. In stead I've got (a quite hilarious) explanation from one of the republishers:
'--i just wanted to get my views up hope u understand'
OH, so NOW I understand.. It was simply to lure ignorant people to view his other sketches, how nice indeed..

hi gerbear'just drew an eagle ' two hours is that what happened to it,its not the first time ive lost a draw''can they really be taken by someone.

Someone mentioned the deleting thing could be a problem as they could make multiple copies or delete the original or whatever. I think now, that perhaps a warning should be given from the ADMIN that if they don't delete the picture within..say a wk (in case they don't come right back) that they will be banned from the site. I did sign Sunsi's but not sure if anyone actually took it straight to Matt and Andrew. I will take this once I get enuff comments and suggestions.

I think Sunsi ?? also sent something like this around and I haven't heard anything about that one either. I hope someone, who can do something about this problem, takes notice.

Oh, I noticed the thief has only been here 15 days. I bet she doesnt know.

Wow I've had the same problem with so many of my drawings. I even started a petition which seemingly went unnoticed. But I COMPLETELY AGREE AND SUPPORT THIS CAUSE!

Did you write the girl and ask her to delete it? I've had a lot of those with Naruto pics. They always delete it. I think they are trying to save the pics as favorites or something.

My beautiful flower picture was ripped off by a 14 yr old and she changed nothing but the title!!
I am furious. We need the right to be able to DELETE OUR OWN artwork from these rip off thieves. I don't mind an add on for humor to my work, but not out right stealing to get attention for their pathetic selves. I don't care if the girl who ripped me off is
ONLY 14, this WILL stop. I know many artists are upset about this too. Please sign below and when i get enough comments I will make sure that Matt and Andrew see this. Sorry to be so angry, but u don't steal other peoples artwork, ever!!!!