I think just by drawing and using Sketchfu, you should expect and anticipate that at any moment in time someone will take your drawing and change it and republish it in some way. I do not consider changing someone's drawing on Sketchfu "stealing", and I think that it's great that we are able to share and collaborate different pieces of artwork.

If someone does something "insulting" to "your" drawing, don't be offended. Ignore it; feel sorry for those people. You shouldn't feel upset, or as if someone is trying to maliciously degrade "your" drawing. CALM DOWN.

I didn't realize until now that so many people are upset by that. It seems pointless to be so upset by something inevitable.

There is also something you should know about me personally, pertinent to this topic. I participated in 2 collaberative projects with the artist Judy Chicago. If you don't know her, please google her. She is very well known and even in the newest version of Jansons History of Art, the college art history bible. The Brooklyn Museum just built a special wing to permanently house her monumental participatory project THE DINNER PARTY. I spent 3 full years, close to 10 hours a week needlepointing over her painted picture for the BIRTH PROJECT. I assigned the rights of the piece to the organization that curates her work, Through the Flower. It was a true collaboration, i had input, we made changes. My second project with her was even more participatory, a small group of us and Judy brainstormed the new project, discussed all the images and got to pick which piece we wanted. I am part owner of the piece should it ever sell I get paid my percentage. That one is called RESOLUTIONS: A Stitch in Time. So I have devoted close to 5 yrs of my life to making art with others. I have no problem with that at all. *S*

OK, having pondered this, not because of your drawings, but because 2 of my works were recently stolen and I got upset, I think I can distill my feelings down to what really bothers me. I think you and I are comparing apples and oranges.

I don't have a problem with remixing. At least for most of my art, in fact some of it lends itself to just that. I looked at all of your drawings you linked to and most of them were communal draws or theme draws where the original artist asks for collaborators. So you are not "taking" it without asking, they are made for the sole purpose of being shared. That aspect is one of my favorites here. I participate in almost everyone that comes my way if I have time. My gallery has more SHARED art in it then my OWN individual work. I love the community feeling it promotes and a sense of trust in a way, that no one is going to be a jerk and ruin everyones efforts on the piece.

To me those are not remixes, not the communal nor the themes like lily and my new Wheres Willy gallery which is for everyone to draw in. To me a remix is what Rogier does. He places ART, ergo funny art, on top of art. And he does not ask permission. If someone does not want a piece done by him, I have seen him politely asked to take it down and he immediately has. We all trust that is how he operates and I think most would welcome his add ons. But he gives us the respect due the original artist by letting us ultimately choose what we want. To me a remix is your artwork swirling over and around anothers in your own charming way. That is ART over art. To just garner an idea from another piece yet make your own to me is not remixing but getting inspired. I could probably quote you many many artists who allude to other artworks in their pieces. I understand it is done.

To digress for one sec you made the comment that this site is set up for remixing and therefore remixing should happen. Well guns are available in a store near me, should i buy one just because it is available? Or should I buy one because I have a GOOD reason to want to buy one.

To bring this thought back into the discussion, I feel that the above examples are "good reasons to buy a gun". I feel that scribbling over, defacing or just copying to ones gallery with a false signature is not a good reason to buy a gun.

If I wanted to remix a draw and the artist was not available to ask I would write a short note as to why their particular piece inspired me to work further with it and would let them know that should they be unhappy with it, I would remove it. Yes, that is censoring and perhaps their piece is traditional and my remix is modern and they hate it and ask for it to be taken down. I still feel they should have that right. What is stopping me from making my own drawing inspired from theirs and then they have no say. It is the defacing, the stealing and what I personally view as lack of respect for the artist when they are not told they will be remixed that upsets me. It is all about courtesy, manners and respect and yes, those things will curtail some freedoms but they also keep environments a much more pleasant place to be *grin*.

Well of course I was long winded, sorry *L*
So..Stealing and defacing is in my mind an apple.
Remixing either at the artists request or because you are inspired is an orange.

And there is a very funny story about ownership, one of my all time favorites really. Throughout American history we were taught that the Pilgrims bought Manhattan Island for some trinkets, beads from the Native Americans. And we were taught that the Native Americans got the raw end of the deal and that they were dumb to "give" away such valuable property for a pittance. Uh huh, I believed that way for a long time. Then once when learning about the Native Americans attitude toward the land it suddenly all became crystal clear what really happened. They believed that man does NOT own the earth, rather, the earth allows them to live on it, share in its bounty but man does not and cannot "own" the very land. So in their eyes, they felt they were getting the better end of the bargain. They had "tricked" the settlers into buying something from them that was not even theirs to sell.
Two sides to every story *grin*

Note, the following comment is NOT a comment on this artist! It's just an opionion on the subject in question:

Nobody can own air....but then, you and I don't make that do we? And cave men and the artists for eons after didn't have something called a copyright law....lol.

Like it or lump it, it's part of the world we live in. Reality may bite for some, but, there it is. If you can make it, no matter the art form, you CAN own it.

Example 1): If I write a song do you have the right to record it without persmission? ~ NO. Royalties are paid to the author/performers, surviving family members, and/or music companies.

Example 2): If I design a line of clothing, do you have the right to copy it and market it without persmission? ~ NO.

Example 3): If I write a poem, do you have the right to publish it without persmission? ~ NO. May you quote it without permission? ~ Verbally, yes, as long as you reference where it came from. Republish it? ~ That would be at the discretion of the original author/publisher or publishing house.

Example 4): If I want to put on a well known play at the local high school without paying for the scripts? ~ NO. Yet again, the writers, publishing houses, and sometimes family members of the writer do get royalties from the sales.

If "you", (meaning anyone, not necessarily you personally), get those examples and can respect them, then "you" have to be able to respect the wishes of those who create visual art as well. They too have the law behind them should they choose to invoke it. Like it, or lump it, "you" must live with the consequences of your actions.

Sorry if I went on a bit. Just my two cents worth.

And I totally agree with Gerbear! You ARE an awesome artist! I look forward to viewing your gallery further!!

Keep those colors flowin', may all "your" choices be good ones, and have fun at sketchfu!

Miss A.

Hmmm... Gerbear does bring up the point of my not remixing much. I guess I see remixing as not *just* filling in empty spaces or coloring in, but using the original idea, lines, and/or colors of a piece and going somewhere suggested in your own mind by it. I think that some of the communal drawings do fall in this category. Also, if a theme is suggested by another, the direction one takes it is still pretty personal. From my own art I would consider http://sketchfu.com/drawing/79743 to be remixing, and some others:
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/94983-amina
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/76838-fnsh-brb
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/27953-after-tbinto even though the original is gone now :(
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/25364-shrooms-too
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/4271-lolpanda --not very successful, but a remix
http://sketchfu.com/drawing/18594-continued even though little of the original remains, the drawing is a remix because of the inspiration of the original. In my opinion.

as far as http://sketchfu.com/drawing/80690 goes:
Straight coloring in *could* be considered remixing. You're adding a different element and making the art something that neither one would have done alone. It's true that many visual artist work alone, but not exclusively so. In commercial art especially, it's often a group affair. Comics are often inked by one person and colored by another-- sometimes there's a third person who comes up with the initial story.

As far as remixing without permission, many artists have done that. I think most of the time, when it gains notoriety, it usually involves some kind of parody or commentary. There are thousands of remixes of the Mona Lisa, mostly for humor or social commentary. Warhol became famous for mostly remixing the work of others. There's that guy who's known for doing intricate one-sided forgeries of money: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JSG_Boggs

There are lots of other examples I could think of. Perhaps I'll list them somewhere, but this comment is long already. I certainly do appreciate your comments, Gerbear.

Oh, and since inflection is so much and missing on here, let me say that I have stated all my comments in a calm, reasoned voice with no anger or rancor whatsoever. I am a huge believer in people saying just what they believe and I respect other opinions even if I don't happen to agree with them and it is never personal. I think you are a phenom artist. *S*

I would also like to understand the point of remixing too.

I love the communal drawings, but that is NOT remxing, that is adding another piece in an empty space art.

I like the themed art pictures, but that is not remixing either.

I like the "please color this in" art and have done several of those. Is that remixing? Coloring in? To me it seems to only be coloring in. While I like my results on the couple i have done, it does not feel like "my" art as I have always worked alone, AS MOST VISUAL ARTISTS do. We are not musicians in a BAND or actors in a TROUPE or dancers in a COMPANY. Visual artists usually make their art alone so why do you have such an issue with that? Why do you suggest more remixing? Have YOU personally done any remixing? I don't see any in your own gallery yet you are encouraging others to do so. And again, exactly what is remixing? And what exactly is the point? To collaborate? You don't think the remixer need ask permission from the original artist so that is not like any collab I ever heard of. Perhaps i need more info as to what you really mean by all of this. Somehow I see this as just playing devils advocate. Why is remixing good, what is it and whats the point and who benefits from it? just curious.

Without rules of some kind, silly or not, society breaks down.
there have to be boundaries. Pure sharing, everything free and "belonging" to everyone else does not work in reality. See the failed communes of the 60's or communist cultures. Even the most primitive cultures all have some form of "ownership". Ideally in some other alternate universe, perhaps it could exist. I feel art is the same. My own WORK is MY work, be it lawn mowing, cooking or painting. My time, taken from MY finite life. I believe in sharing but I also believe in the societal rule of ASKING first, not stealing. It is called manners and that is how civilization exists without dissolving into chaos. I have studied lots of theories and nothing works but private ownership of some things.

Now, putting something on the net and expecting it to NOT be stolen, that is silly and I know I am being silly every time I get upset that it HAS been stolen. i am sharing it by putting out here. it is in a public shared space. I dont feel anyone needs to move it to their gallery. It is being shared in MY gallery.

But as you said, not everyone needs to agree on things, what a boring world it would be. *S*

Yeah, just so everyone knows, even though I sometimes think it's kind of silly I definitely do all of those things, and sometimes dream of being a commercial artist no less!

Bless our inconsistent human selves, right? OK, I'm done with the preachy crap for a bit :)

but I meant it all

VERY silly